Maybe package Holmberg AND Robertson for a 3C? Or do you run Kampf and Dewar as 3/4C and bring in a 3rd line nasty physical type?
- Roadrunner75

Last game they ran:

Knies - Matthews - Marner
Pacioretty - Tavares - Nylander
McMann - Domi - Holmberg
Lorentz - Kampf - Reaves

Dewar coming in is interesting. His entire career in Minnesota, he'd basically been a Centre, but in Toronto we used him as a LW at the end of the year.

Lorentz definitely makes that 4th line click, so you'd be reluctant to put Dewar in his stead there, but McMann can play LW or RW, so you could put Dewar with Domi on the 3rd line. I don't think that's a particularly appealing line, but you'd add speed and defensive awareness replacing Holmberg with Dewar.

Another Dubas midget that was never an NHL quality player. He's a perimeter player at best, who was terrified out on the ice. Too bad that they wasted a first on him, but Dubas loved his analytics. Pittsburgh has this turd now, so it's all good. Liljegren should be able to play on a rebuilding team but will end up a journeyman kicking around the perimeters of the league.
- PrinceLH

Dubas also managed to get a 1st and a roster player for a comparable player by trading him at the deadline. Just a bit better than holding him to the point you get caught in a poop contract and have to sell for some middling picks and a can.

So there's that.

With Robertson I get it if Berube ends up not wanting to play him in the top 9, and he can not play on the 4th...but they have to either trade him or play him and let him keep his value or raise it.

I like how he has looked. You give him some rope and the pucks are going to go in.
- Santo_44

At a minimum Nick Robertson can carve out a career similar to Daniel Sprong - excel against lower tier players, but never defensively capable enough to excel against better players.

Benning puts up good defensive results in a 3rd pairing role.

He is also paid accordingly.

So yeah no, he does not blow complete chunks.
- Santo_44

It’s true - playing with much better players on the Leafs could make him less bad …

However - he doesn’t skate as well nor does move the puck as well as Lilly … just don’t expect much and you wont be let down.

Like most have said - the big return was cap space. And a couple picks-

It’s true - playing with much better players on the Leafs could make him less bad …

However - he doesn’t skate as well nor does move the puck as well as Lilly … just don’t expect much and you wont be let down.

Like most have said - the big return was cap space. And a couple picks-
- dozerD10

That is the win here. Got a serviceable depth guy and some middling picks where people thought he had negative value

I'm gonna slap my dog if Reaves is not the next forward sent down.

Don't make me do that.

Well, better the dodgers than yankees i guess.
Glad it was a short series

Well, better the dodgers than yankees i guess.
Glad it was a short series
- Fakepartofme

def better that the Dodgers won. f the skankees

I'm gonna slap my dog if Reaves is not the next forward sent down.

Don't make me do that.
- GalacticStone

It really depends on what they want from their role players and what they need for versatility.

Reaves: Good: Does win board battles, contributes effectively to an O-Zone cycle. Wears down opposition D better than most on the team
Bad: Has limited offensive and defensive capabilities. Does not do special teams. Tires quickly.

Holmberg: Good: Is Marner's pretend favourite player? Does PK, but is actually the worst forward on the PK - last in CA/60, SA/60, GA/60, SCA/60 and is second last in HDCA/60

The thing is that Reaves is only getting worse and more useless. Holmberg is 25 is probably not getting too much better from here, but he is definitely off to a bad start this year and we know he can be better than _this_ - but he'll generally be a player that isn't too hard to replace.

So if I was asked to pick a player to replace right _now_ based on what they contribute to the team right now, knowing that a better PK player in Dewar was coming into the lineup? I'd probably pick Holmberg to go to the Marlies and hope he clears.

def better that the Dodgers won. f the skankees
- senstroll

Gerrit Cole not covering 1st helping the Dodgers tie the game

also

Dan Clark
@DanClarkSports
In 2020, Aaron Judge's girlfriend (now wife), Samantha Bracksieck, was arrested for extreme DUI in Arizona. Administered two breathalyzer tests at the police station, her readings of .169 and .181 were both far higher than Judge's 2024 World Series batting average of .133.

def better that the Dodgers won. f the skankees
- senstroll

Yup.
And F Gerrit Cole, glad they lit him up.

I'm gonna slap my dog if Reaves is not the next forward sent down.

Don't make me do that.
- GalacticStone

Its only hockey, doesnt matter.

Yup.
And F Gerrit Cole, glad they lit him up.
- Fakepartofme

technically he had zero earned runs, cuz of the errors...but he contributed to it ..so yeah f garry cole

It’s true - playing with much better players on the Leafs could make him less bad …

However - he doesn’t skate as well nor does move the puck as well as Lilly … just don’t expect much and you wont be let down.

Like most have said - the big return was cap space. And a couple picks-
- dozerD10

Mirtle doesn't seem to think he'll be around long anyways. "A throw in at San Jose's request to make the money work".

It's a 3rd, 6th, and a dump.

It really depends on what they want from their role players and what they need for versatility.

Reaves: Good: Does win board battles, contributes effectively to an O-Zone cycle. Wears down opposition D better than most on the team
Bad: Has limited offensive and defensive capabilities. Does not do special teams. Tires quickly.

Holmberg: Good: Is Marner's pretend favourite player? Does PK, but is actually the worst forward on the PK - last in CA/60, SA/60, GA/60, SCA/60 and is second last in HDCA/60

The thing is that Reaves is only getting worse and more useless. Holmberg is 25 is probably not getting too much better from here, but he is definitely off to a bad start this year and we know he can be better than _this_ - but he'll generally be a player that isn't too hard to replace.

So if I was asked to pick a player to replace right _now_ based on what they contribute to the team right now, knowing that a better PK player in Dewar was coming into the lineup? I'd probably pick Holmberg to go to the Marlies and hope he clears.
- Monkeypunk

Maybe he works better under Berube's system, or maybe he sensed his position on the big club's roster was in jeopardy, because he (Reaver) seems a little better this year. Granted, it's a small sample size and my opinion mostly comes from the stat sheets and the chatter on the web from other Leafs fans. Admittedly, I haven't watched many games yet, Leafs or Lightning (been too busy and Milton didn't help).

My only concern is, if they lose Holmberg to waivers then they only get $800k in cap relief. If somebody claims Reaves, we get almost double that. I'd send Reaves down and pray somebody claims him and that Holmberg can tighten up his game and be an asset instead of a passenger.

Edit (unrelated) :

Guentzel (10 games) – 4g, 7a, +8, (5v5 points - 10)
Stamkos (9 games) – 1g, 2a, -7, (5v5 points - 1)

I'm gonna slap my dog if Reaves is not the next forward sent down.

Don't make me do that.
- GalacticStone

I'm gonna spank my monkey.

Maybe he works better under Berube's system, or maybe he sensed his position on the big club's roster was in jeopardy, because he (Reaver) seems a little better this year. Granted, it's a small sample size and my opinion mostly comes from the stat sheets and the chatter on the web from other Leafs fans. Admittedly, I haven't watched many games yet, Leafs or Lightning (been too busy and Milton didn't help).

My only concern is, if they lose Holmberg to waivers then they only get $800k in cap relief. If somebody claims Reaves, we get almost double that. I'd send Reaves down and pray somebody claims him and that Holmberg can tighten up his game and be an asset instead of a passenger.
- GalacticStone

The cap isn't really a concern. Note that if you waive Reaves, you save $1.15m on his cap hit and $200k still counts against the cap - but you save $1.15m. If you waive Holmberg, you save $800k against the cap - so your difference is $315k either way.

The Leafs aren't as tight to the cap as you'd think.

Today they have 13F, 8D, 2G and 4 players on LTIR - which is a total of $90.5m - $5.5m in LTIR - so they have approximately $3m to fiddle with.

Benning or Myers (there's a $500k difference in salary there - so is Benning $500k better? They're both 6/7 guys, so odds are Myers gets the nod over Benning - but let's say it's Myers who goes down and for now let's say it's Holmberg who goes and you activate Hakanpaa and Dewar - your total cap hit is $88.95m with $2.88m remaining in LTIR (Jarnkrok and Mermis) - so again, about $1.9m or so under the cap - but still living in LTIR, so no accrual.

When Jarnkrok returns, that's the next forward decision - and the one that actually matters - because they can remove Mermis from the pool and then it's likely Robertson or Reaves (or Holmberg if they'd gone Reaves earlier). Let's say that they go Reaves here so Reaves and Holmberg are the two forwards that lose positions to Dewar and Jarnkrok - you end up with a 23 man roster and $981,563 under the cap with no LTIR. If they'd waived Benning instead of Myers (and he's claimed), they'd have $1.46m under the cap (if he's not claimed it's $1.36m).

So the upshot of that math is that whether they keep Holmberg or Reaves or Robertson doesn't matter - and whether they demote Myers or Benning also wouldn't matter. The cap is under control. The only variable here is how much they want in the pool for accrual when (hopefully) everyone is healthy.

O'Really?
- The Law

Man, how'd I miss the Lillybust move?

At the end of the day, it's a meh move. Of course he'll torch us like Bobby Orr the next time we play San Jose, that's an ex-Leaf given...

Cap space and picks are always good, I just would've liked to get a 2nd instead of a 3rd, but we've been doing better picking in the later rounds in recent years, so whatever.

Man, how'd I miss the Lillybust move?

At the end of the day, it's a meh move. Of course he'll torch us like Bobby Orr the next time we play San Jose, that's an ex-Leaf given...

Cap space and picks are always good, I just would've liked to get a 2nd instead of a 3rd, but we've been doing better picking in the later rounds in recent years, so whatever.
- gravyface

It's a great move. The Leafs get a serviceable defensive third pair d-man who you can rotate in or out of the lineup plus a couple of picks that you can package up at the TDL (3rd and 6th). And, as you said, we clear up additional cap space which is super useful.

This is excellent value for a guy the entire league knew the Leafs needed to dump somewhere.

I have always been a Liljegren fan but he just never seemed to be able to elevate his game to a Top 4 level. Maybe with some seasoning playing in that role on a dumpster fire team may give him the experience he needs to continue to evolve... but I suspect his ceiling isn't much higher than it already is.

Reading some predictions on Juan Soto contract

somewhere between $561M and $602M over 14 years

Man, how'd I miss the Lillybust move?

At the end of the day, it's a meh move. Of course he'll torch us like Bobby Orr the next time we play San Jose, that's an ex-Leaf given...

Cap space and picks are always good, I just would've liked to get a 2nd instead of a 3rd, but we've been doing better picking in the later rounds in recent years, so whatever.
- gravyface

His talent level is that you can easily replace him at the defenceman store every July 12th, and at a better price than $3M/year.

The thing is that Reaves is only getting worse and more useless. Holmberg is 25 is probably not getting too much better from here, but he is definitely off to a bad start this year and we know he can be better than _this_ - but he'll generally be a player that isn't too hard to replace.

- Monkeypunk

Reaves had 9 shifts on Monday, for 5:27 of ice time.

I don't want to get my hopes up too much, but maybe, just maybe Berube is starting to see what I've seen all along.

It's a great move. The Leafs get a serviceable defensive third pair d-man who you can rotate in or out of the lineup plus a couple of picks that you can package up at the TDL (3rd and 6th). And, as you said, we clear up additional cap space which is super useful.

This is excellent value for a guy the entire league knew the Leafs needed to dump somewhere.

I have always been a Liljegren fan but he just never seemed to be able to elevate his game to a Top 4 level. Maybe with some seasoning playing in that role on a dumpster fire team may give him the experience he needs to continue to evolve... but I suspect his ceiling isn't much higher than it already is.
- mjones242

The return is not the worst given the scenario they found themselves in with Liljegren, but that's the problem, they managed themselves into that mess.

Sandin was on the same trajectory and having the stones to ship him at the deadline found them a 1st and a roster player, that 1st turned into the teams best prospect. Piss poor asset management to have worked themselves into this spot with Lily.

The talking heads are indicating Benning was a dump at SJ's request to make the dollars work and likely won't be around for long. Makes sense as the team isn't going to carry 9 D once Hakanpaa is activated in the next couple days and Myers provides the same for cheaper.

Dubas also managed to get a 1st and a roster player for a comparable player by trading him at the deadline. Just a bit better than holding him to the point you get caught in a poop contract and have to sell for some middling picks and a can.

So there's that.
- joel878

Sandin was 21 years old.

Not the same.