Of course there is the possibility that it is on the player. There is also blame to be placed at the development process. Just because you don't put any blame on the doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Why don't you put any of it on the Flyers?

Flyers track record of developing dman is not good. Did they allocate the resources into Attard to develop him?

Remember the bold next time your beating the door down for them to play Ginning or the like. Maybe they have determined just that. He isn't capable.
- login

I’m not very high on the flyers that as a team develops players well.
There are outliers such as Giroux and TK that exceed expectations relative to their draft position.
There are many players despite being drafted at a fairly high 1st round pick never meet expectations.
Provorov, Farabee, Frost, Hart, JVR, Nolan Patrick, come to immediate mind.
Now either the scouting department is not that good or player development is lacking.
There may also be another option. Misuse of the player to suit the teams immediate needs.
That can also tie in to player development I suppose.

You want to ask me questions when you haven't stated or made your case as to why you think the Flyers screwed up his development. Tell me how specifically they did and then we can discuss it.




Yes, I want the Flyers to give NHL prospects playing time in the NHL as a team that is supposedly rebuilding. Attard has played 29 NHL games and Ginning has played 10 NHL games.
- MJL

Tell me how they didn't? Then we can discuss it. Easy to play that game.

So now you have confidence in Lappy and his staff over the last few years in developing players?

Rebuilding or not why would they play players who they deem are not NHL level. Like they did with Attard. So if they determined he isnn't NHL level makes zero sense to play him.

Everryone vote today we need to beat the fraud and overwhelm the cheat.
- bird_dog_pa

I just voted. Saw Dave McCormick outside my polling place. I didn’t realize he was so short. I’m 5’9” and I’m at least 2” taller than him. He looks taller on tv. I told him to go back to Connecticut.

I’m not very high on the flyers that as a team develops players well.
There are outliers such as Giroux and TK that exceed expectations relative to their draft position.
There are many players despite being drafted at a fairly high 1st round pick never meet expectations.
Provorov, Farabee, Frost, Hart, JVR, Nolan Patrick, come to immediate mind.
Now either the scouting department is not that good or player development is lacking.
There may also be another option. Misuse of the player to suit the teams immediate needs.
That can also tie in to player development I suppose.
- bird_dog_pa

Talent evaluation is a huge issue to me.

I just voted. Saw Dave McCormick outside my polling place. I didn’t realize he was so short. I’m 5’9” and I’m at least 2” taller than him. He looks taller on tv. I told him to go back to Connecticut.
- Dkos

Was he there to vote?

I’m not very high on the flyers that as a team develops players well.
There are outliers such as Giroux and TK that exceed expectations relative to their draft position.
There are many players despite being drafted at a fairly high 1st round pick never meet expectations.
Provorov, Farabee, Frost, Hart, JVR, Nolan Patrick, come to immediate mind.
Now either the scouting department is not that good or player development is lacking.
There may also be another option. Misuse of the player to suit the teams immediate needs.
That can also tie in to player development I suppose.
- bird_dog_pa

Most of these have nothing to do with developing IMO.

Provorov is what he is, I dont think anything the Flyers did or could have done would have changed that. Flyers added Risto and made him into a competent defender. There is no reason to believe that they could help make Provorov better if he was open to it. He was still young when moved and hasnt performed better in Columbus. Not to mention Sanheim has excelled since Provy left playing above his means. Dont forget York has been successful too and has developed well as a Flyer. I dont buy it.

Hart maybe was brought up too early but at the same time he has been dealing with the Sexual assault case. That has likely been on his mind for a while and impacting his play.

Nolan Patrick was never a case of development, his issue was health

JVR Developed as expected. He was never projected to be an elite player. No one saw him as a Patrik Kane type player. Flyers barely had him either. They traded him before he developed and the Leafs had his best years.

There is nothing wrong with Farabee. He is 24 and set a career high of 50 points. He is almost exactly where he was projected to be as a top 6 wing.

I see no issues with development. Flyers simply havent had opportunities for cant miss prospects due to not tanking and the few they had they either got screwed over(Kane) or selected a guy whos career ended due to injuries.

Even Frost's failures are on himself. The team was patient with him, he wasnt rushed, spent lots of time in the AHL, did well at that level and hasnt really been able to adapt that to the NHL. Watching him play he basically just stops playing after making a play in the offensive zone. The one play people blame Frost for missing an open net, that he had no chance on is an example of that. It is true he was in deep and taking a puck on the off hand making it a tough angle to tap in however after that pass to Hathaway, he stopped moving. He should have put himself in a better position, Hathaway had a low chance of scoring because its Hathaway, he should be inticipating what happens next if he doesnt score. He was in no position for that pass, no position for the rebound and he was in no position to recover the puck if Hathaway missed the net.

The Way the Flyers run the team they need to get lucky and find a elite player late and those are rare. Theres maybe 1 per year outside of Round 1, not counting goalies.

Everryone vote today we need to beat the fraud and overwhelm the cheat.
- bird_dog_pa

Men need to get out there to vote.

Simple as that really.

our future leaders............err followers. What is wrong with these administrators.

https://www.thefp.com/p/g...n-safe-space-trump-kamala

our future leaders............err followers. What is wrong with these administrators.

https://www.thefp.com/p/g...n-safe-space-trump-kamala
- bird_dog_pa

Those are some resilient young people colleges are creating. Can't wait to live in a society where that is the norm.

Most of these have nothing to do with developing IMO.

Provorov is what he is, I dont think anything the Flyers did or could have done would have changed that. Flyers added Risto and made him into a competent defender. There is no reason to believe that they could help make Provorov better if he was open to it. He was still young when moved and hasnt performed better in Columbus. Not to mention Sanheim has excelled since Provy left playing above his means. Dont forget York has been successful too and has developed well as a Flyer. I dont buy it.

Hart maybe was brought up too early but at the same time he has been dealing with the Sexual assault case. That has likely been on his mind for a while and impacting his play.

Nolan Patrick was never a case of development, his issue was health

JVR Developed as expected. He was never projected to be an elite player. No one saw him as a Patrik Kane type player. Flyers barely had him either. They traded him before he developed and the Leafs had his best years.

There is nothing wrong with Farabee. He is 24 and set a career high of 50 points. He is almost exactly where he was projected to be as a top 6 wing.

I see no issues with development. Flyers simply havent had opportunities for cant miss prospects due to not tanking and the few they had they either got screwed over(Kane) or selected a guy whos career ended due to injuries.

Even Frost's failures are on himself. The team was patient with him, he wasnt rushed, spent lots of time in the AHL, did well at that level and hasnt really been able to adapt that to the NHL. Watching him play he basically just stops playing after making a play in the offensive zone. The one play people blame Frost for missing an open net, that he had no chance on is an example of that. It is true he was in deep and taking a puck on the off hand making it a tough angle to tap in however after that pass to Hathaway, he stopped moving. He should have put himself in a better position, Hathaway had a low chance of scoring because its Hathaway, he should be inticipating what happens next if he doesnt score. He was in no position for that pass, no position for the rebound and he was in no position to recover the puck if Hathaway missed the net.

The Way the Flyers run the team they need to get lucky and find a elite player late and those are rare. Theres maybe 1 per year outside of Round 1, not counting goalies.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Then is it the drafting?

Why dont you see anything wrong with the development process? Outside the first 2 rounds what do they really have to show in their development process?

So…….we all on a ship with no captain now, eh?

Those are some resilient young people colleges are creating. Can't wait to live in a society where that is the norm.
- jfkst1

I can guarantee you wouldn't even get on the waiting list.

Most of these have nothing to do with developing IMO.

Provorov is what he is, I dont think anything the Flyers did or could have done would have changed that. Flyers added Risto and made him into a competent defender. There is no reason to believe that they could help make Provorov better if he was open to it. He was still young when moved and hasnt performed better in Columbus. Not to mention Sanheim has excelled since Provy left playing above his means. Dont forget York has been successful too and has developed well as a Flyer. I dont buy it.

Hart maybe was brought up too early but at the same time he has been dealing with the Sexual assault case. That has likely been on his mind for a while and impacting his play.

Nolan Patrick was never a case of development, his issue was health

JVR Developed as expected. He was never projected to be an elite player. No one saw him as a Patrik Kane type player. Flyers barely had him either. They traded him before he developed and the Leafs had his best years.

There is nothing wrong with Farabee. He is 24 and set a career high of 50 points. He is almost exactly where he was projected to be as a top 6 wing.

I see no issues with development. Flyers simply havent had opportunities for cant miss prospects due to not tanking and the few they had they either got screwed over(Kane) or selected a guy whos career ended due to injuries.

Even Frost's failures are on himself. The team was patient with him, he wasnt rushed, spent lots of time in the AHL, did well at that level and hasnt really been able to adapt that to the NHL. Watching him play he basically just stops playing after making a play in the offensive zone. The one play people blame Frost for missing an open net, that he had no chance on is an example of that. It is true he was in deep and taking a puck on the off hand making it a tough angle to tap in however after that pass to Hathaway, he stopped moving. He should have put himself in a better position, Hathaway had a low chance of scoring because its Hathaway, he should be inticipating what happens next if he doesnt score. He was in no position for that pass, no position for the rebound and he was in no position to recover the puck if Hathaway missed the net.

The Way the Flyers run the team they need to get lucky and find a elite player late and those are rare. Theres maybe 1 per year outside of Round 1, not counting goalies.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

I disagree with Provorov. He went from a dman that would crash the net and press in the offensive zone to being more conservative. He said it himself. Granted i dont think he was ever going to quarterback the power play but his play fell off the cliff as his time with the flyers wore on.
JVR became a better player after leaving the flyers says it all. He was traded for Luke Schenn who was really not a very good dman.
Nolan Patrick didnt do much before his injuries got the better of his career. I didn't see him doing much even if he wasn't dealing with injuries.
As far as Hart that is an excuse. Before the legal issues came to light he was a good goalie and nothing more. His junior career was very good.
The jury is out on Farabee. Torterella might just be an anchor on Farabee's neck.
Sanheim is off to a very good year.
How many players do the flyers draft where they exceed expectations and become a very good player.
They can't even develop fourth line players they draft despite loving to draft 200' players.

Most of these have nothing to do with developing IMO.

Provorov is what he is, I dont think anything the Flyers did or could have done would have changed that. Flyers added Risto and made him into a competent defender. There is no reason to believe that they could help make Provorov better if he was open to it. He was still young when moved and hasnt performed better in Columbus. Not to mention Sanheim has excelled since Provy left playing above his means. Dont forget York has been successful too and has developed well as a Flyer. I dont buy it.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

First off the bat, I disagree. The Flyers made the #1 mistake you can make with a young player concerning Provorov. Elevating him in either where he is playing or in what role he is playing. They used him as their #1 defenseman since he was 19 years old. When he should've broken in to the league playing in a lesser role on a lower pairing. The Flyers blatantly mis-handled Provorov's development.

JVR Developed as expected. He was never projected to be an elite player. No one saw him as a Patrik Kane type player. Flyers barely had him either. They traded him before he developed and the Leafs had his best years.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Giving up on a player too early isn't a development mistake?

I see no issues with development. Flyers simply havent had opportunities for cant miss prospects due to not tanking and the few they had they either got screwed over(Kane) or selected a guy whos career ended due to injuries.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

The Flyers are one of the worst development teams in the NHL. They have far too many failures and players not reaching their ceiling to make the statement that they don't have development issues.

Even Frost's failures are on himself. The team was patient with him, he wasnt rushed, spent lots of time in the AHL, did well at that level and hasnt really been able to adapt that to the NHL. Watching him play he basically just stops playing after making a play in the offensive zone. The one play people blame Frost for missing an open net, that he had no chance on is an example of that. It is true he was in deep and taking a puck on the off hand making it a tough angle to tap in however after that pass to Hathaway, he stopped moving. He should have put himself in a better position, Hathaway had a low chance of scoring because its Hathaway, he should be inticipating what happens next if he doesnt score. He was in no position for that pass, no position for the rebound and he was in no position to recover the puck if Hathaway missed the net.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Frost was badly mishandled by the Flyers. First under Yeo and his idiotic development tactics and making a skilled offensive players, play as a checking player because he has to play well away from the puck before a player can play to his strengths. That is old school archaic processes that top teams don't do. It is essentially in effect making a player play with one hand behind his back. Then there is Tortorella who repeatedly scratched him, benched him and played him down in the lineup.
You're also wrong on that 2 on 1. It was an awful play by Hathaway not to shoot the puck. Frost gave him an open net. By the time the puck came back to Frost, he was at a sever angle with a low percentage chance to score.

Everryone vote today we need to beat the fraud and overwhelm the cheat.
- bird_dog_pa

You just described both candidates.

This is going to go down as a sad day for the USA when all is said and done.
- login

The sad part has already happened- we have to select from 2 unqualified candidates.

The sad part has already happened- we have to select from 2 unqualified candidates.
- missingmike

One has a track record of doing a good job while President. Take that any day over this fake unqualified woman.

One has a track record of doing a good job while President. Take that any day over this fake unqualified woman.
- login

Okay, I will bite.
We collectively on this thread harp on Torts for alienating players against him in a small controlled environment. Yet some of us enthusiastically cast votes for a guy, who alienates and berates millions of people.
Regardless of his policies, qualification must include character.

The sad part has already happened- we have to select from 2 unqualified candidates.
- missingmike

Kommiela is on record wanting to raise capitol gains taxes, corporate taxes, taxing unrealized gains ie. houses etc. Sure that is just for the rich. Well what is the definition of rich. Once that pandora's box is open your not getting it closed.
She has said she will let Trump's tax cuts expire.
Are you ready for the flood of illegals to continue? Are you ready for energy prices to continue to escalate? Kommiela cosponsored the green new steal.
If the woman cant sit down with friendly news outlets and answer questions without imploding how is she going to sit down and talk to leaders of antagonistic nations that are undermining our country?
Harris will be a puppet and we all know it.

Okay, I will bite.
We collectively on this thread berating Torts for alienating players against him in a small controlled environment. Yet some of us enthusiastically cast votes for a guy, who alienates millions of people.
Regardless of his policies, qualification must include character.
- missingmike

I pick based on polices and his track record as president. To me it really is that simple.

Don't care what he tweets, what he says, or anything in between. The country and world were in a better place during his 4 years.. Do you disagree?

I urge everyone to go to the polls today. And in doing so, remember Peanut the Squirrel.

🐿️

I'm trying very hard to stay out of political discussion today. See if I can do it. I'm not confident. The campaigning is over. Nobody is going to convince anyone of anything on Nov 5th. Exercise your right and opportunity to have a say and go vote.

Kommiela is on record wanting to raise capitol gains taxes, corporate taxes, taxing unrealized gains ie. houses etc. Sure that is just for the rich. Well what is the definition of rich. Once that pandora's box is open your not getting it closed.
She has said she will let Trump's tax cuts expire.
Are you ready for the flood of illegals to continue? Are you ready for energy prices to continue to escalate? Kommiela cosponsored the green new steal.
If the woman cant sit down with friendly news outlets and answer questions without imploding how is she going to sit down and talk to leaders of antagonistic nations that are undermining our country?
Harris will be a puppet and we all know it.
- bird_dog_pa

Her lack of qualification does not make him qualified. My premise was that both of them are not qualified. And that is sad for this great country.
As for Harris' policies and approaches- I am a Soviet ex-pat, I already lived through that.

Okay, I will bite.
We collectively on this thread harp on Torts for alienating players against him in a small controlled environment. Yet some of us enthusiastically cast votes for a guy, who alienates and berates millions of people.
Regardless of his policies, qualification must include character.
- missingmike

Drop the berates millions of people act> it's old and really makes you appear intellectually lazy. I have been called racist ,a misogynist, a nazi, deplorable, garbage, an extremist and a terrorist. If you are going to play that game be honest and call out everyone.
Myself i can see rhetoric when i see and hear it. Actions speak louder than words. There is one party who is using the DOJ to target and jail opponents and fellow US citizens. That is of more concern than being bombastic in speeches.
If you trust your government in all aspects sure vote for the status quo. If not then vote for the man who the goverment is targeting since he came down the escalator.